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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2020 12:46:40 GMT -5
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 12, 2020 14:24:00 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 11:43:45 GMT -5
The first sentence of this article confirms my counterpoint, to your point that they don't exist. "In 2017, Antifa, a loose collection of left-leaning militant anti-fascist groups" If you give any personal credence to the article, by its own words, then you must acknowledge that Antifa exists and they're militant. Of course there are groups out there (including extremist right-wing groups) that hate them and would resort to underhanded tactics in the PR wars. I already knew that. One thing I might agree with you on is that Antifa aren't much of a threat (except maybe to older & weaker people), because they're mostly a westernized, pussified version of Communists (i.e. "soyboys"). The main problem I have with Antifa is their flawed ideology. What good has Communism ever done for anybody besides bread lines, gulags, and the bloodiest examples of genocides in human history?
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 13, 2020 12:24:36 GMT -5
The first sentence of this article confirms my counterpoint, to your point that they don't exist. "In 2017, Antifa, a loose collection of left-leaning militant anti-fascist groups" If you give any personal credence to the article, by its own words, then you must acknowledge that Antifa exists and they're militant. Of course there are groups out there (including extremist right-wing groups) that hate them and would resort to underhanded tactics in the PR wars. I already knew that. One thing I might agree with you on is that Antifa aren't much of a threat (except maybe to older & weaker people), because they're mostly a westernized, pussified version of Communists (i.e. "soyboys"). The main problem I have with Antifa is their flawed ideology. What good has Communism ever done for anybody besides bread lines, gulags, and the bloodiest examples of genocides in human history? Oh I have no doubt there are little groups of people who call themselves Antifa. However "Antifa" as this large army that has to be countered isn't real. I was watching another video about fallout from internal drama in some right wing group and they said they need to fly to Portland to "fight Antifa". One of the videos you linked above is in Portland. It seems anytime people are actually having a boots on the ground fight with "Anita" it is in Portland. People have been running around in ski masks in Portland and Seattle since the 1990s but back then they called them Anarchists on the news. How big can "Antifa" be if you have to fly to Portland to have a confrontation? I tried searching for Antifa in my city and I found a couple twitter references and literally the 3rd link on google was referring me back to Portland. Yet like in the link above I posted about the fake news article these right wing sites are just non-stop Antifa Antifa Antifa! OMG ANTIFA! because they need an enemy to fight to justify their own actions. There is a video on Youtube where they ask these militia guys in camo in the wood in the midwest what they are doing and they are literally justifying their own existence because they say they are "fighting antifa". Its all very overblown and silly. As for Communism I don't know if the people out there in Antifa are all self identifying Communists but there are plenty of places in the former USSR that have not reached the standard of living they had under the Communism system. Hence a large amount of nostalgia for the Soviet Union in certain places.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 13:50:19 GMT -5
The first sentence of this article confirms my counterpoint, to your point that they don't exist. "In 2017, Antifa, a loose collection of left-leaning militant anti-fascist groups" If you give any personal credence to the article, by its own words, then you must acknowledge that Antifa exists and they're militant. Of course there are groups out there (including extremist right-wing groups) that hate them and would resort to underhanded tactics in the PR wars. I already knew that. One thing I might agree with you on is that Antifa aren't much of a threat (except maybe to older & weaker people), because they're mostly a westernized, pussified version of Communists (i.e. "soyboys"). The main problem I have with Antifa is their flawed ideology. What good has Communism ever done for anybody besides bread lines, gulags, and the bloodiest examples of genocides in human history? Oh I have no doubt there are little groups of people who call themselves Antifa. However "Antifa" as this large army that has to be countered isn't real. I was watching another video about fallout from internal drama in some right wing group and they said they need to fly to Portland to "fight Antifa". One of the videos you linked above is in Portland. It seems anytime people are actually having a boots on the ground fight with "Anita" it is in Portland. People have been running around in ski masks in Portland and Seattle since the 1990s but back then they called them Anarchists on the news. How big can "Antifa" be if you have to fly to Portland to have a confrontation? I tried searching for Antifa in my city and I found a couple twitter references and literally the 3rd link on google was referring me back to Portland. Yet like in the link above I posted about the fake news article these right wing sites are just non-stop Antifa Antifa Antifa! OMG ANTIFA! because they need an enemy to fight to justify their own actions. There is a video on Youtube where they ask these militia guys in camo in the wood in the midwest what they are doing and they are literally justifying their own existence because they say they are "fighting antifa". Its all very overblown and silly. As for Communism I don't know if the people out there in Antifa are all self identifying Communists but there are plenty of places in the former USSR that have not reached the standard of living they had under the Communism system. Hence a large amount of nostalgia for the Soviet Union in certain places. Who said Antifa has a large army? I don't recall that even being your original point. The "counter" was to your original argument on Antifa not existing, not the post edit version of it. Now, people on the left identify people they don't like or agree with as Fascists (oftentimes, those being accused don't self identify as Fascists). So going by the rules that the left has imposed in today's society, is self-identifying even really prerequisite for throwing around labels? lol What we can say, factually and without bias, is that many of Antifa do self identify as Communist and there's video evidence to prove it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 14:07:07 GMT -5
I don't know that the threat is overblown. Antifa does come off as weak when I see them harass elderly people. But I just noticed that there are hundreds of videos on YT showing Antifa and far-right groups clashing (and both committing acts of violence). Thankfully, it appears there aren't many people being killed in these conflicts. Hopefully, it stays that way. Or better yet, people realize that extremism & violence from any group is bad. If you haven't noticed, I'm not sticking up for or defending either "team."
Politics isn't a team sport. There can be nuance, different POV's, and not always towing the line on every issue.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 14:12:38 GMT -5
The Soviet Union lasted about 70 years. There might be a few places where ppl were better off and wish for the old days. Because they did prop up scientists and engineers above the rest of their society, to advance their war machine... even the Soviets realized that ppl aren't as productive without incentives.
On the whole, I think it's a moot point though. We don't see the Eastern European nations, former Soviet block regions, clamoring to return to Communism.
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 13, 2020 14:32:59 GMT -5
I don't know that the threat is overblown. Antifa does come off as weak when I see them harass elderly people. But I just noticed that there are hundreds of videos on YT showing Antifa and far-right groups clashing (and both committing acts of violence). " There are plenty of videos labeled Antifa but are they actually all self identifying members of Anita? I linked earlier a fake news mill making fake Antifa stories. Anyone can upload a video to Youtube and make the title anything they want. People have already been caught showing things that have nothing to do with those people as Antifa. If a dude robs a liquor store in a skimask does the skimask prove he is Antifa?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 14:50:24 GMT -5
I don't know that the threat is overblown. Antifa does come off as weak when I see them harass elderly people. But I just noticed that there are hundreds of videos on YT showing Antifa and far-right groups clashing (and both committing acts of violence). " There are plenty of videos labeled Antifa but are they actually all self identifying members of Anita? I linked earlier a fake news mill making fake Antifa stories. Anyone can upload a video to Youtube and make the title anything they want. People have already been caught showing things that have nothing to do with those people as Antifa. If a dude robs a liquor store in a skimask does the skimask prove he is Antifa? Only pay attention to the ones reported by mainstream media then. If that isn't good enough for and you don't trust the mainstream media, then how do you know Trump is such a bad guy?
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 13, 2020 15:09:07 GMT -5
At the 40 second mark "its 6 am in Portland Oregon". Why is it always Portland? Every single time? Looks like as long as you don't go to Portland you don't have to worry about big scary Antifa.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 16:24:13 GMT -5
Why do we find sharks in the ocean? Well, that's the environment (salt water) most favorable to their biology and so that's where they live.
Skimming just a few videos, I see they've been active in Seattle, D.C., and Germany. Generally, these are leftist areas where the population leans mostly left and perhaps the govt & law are more lenient to them. Portland mayor gave the local police a stand down order regarding Antifa, so naturally that's one of their strongholds. Of course, when you don't enforce the rule of law, you wind up with a shithole. Literally, there's shit in the streets of Portland.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 20:59:00 GMT -5
People. This is why you don't want a hardline Communist Authoritarian regime, like the Chinese Communist Party (CCP), as your government. a.msn.com/r/2/BBZZV78?m=en-us&referrerID=InAppShareDiscrimination, detention, and murder of ethnic Uighurs in China. www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-45474279And, of course, the recent and ongoing CCP crackdown on freedom loving people in Hong Kong, with HK citizen demonstrators vanishing. I'm amazed there are intelligent people out there with access to all of this shit through the internet and, yet, they still defend Communism and leftist perpetrators of violence. Are we sure the actual thinking isn't "go team left"? Or is there no rational thinking behind it and it's all about feelz? haha Personally, I'm not on anybody's team and I don't condone the violence regardless of who's doing it. However, I do favor freedom over tyranny and, if ppl are attacked first, they have the right to defend themselves.
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 15, 2020 21:17:42 GMT -5
I'm amazed there are intelligent people out there with access to all of this shit through the internet and, yet, they s till defend Communism and leftist perpetrators of violence. Are we sure the actual thinking isn't "go team left"? Or is there no rational thinking behind it and it's all about feelz? haha Personally, I'm not on anybody's team and I don't condone the violence regardless of who's doing it. However, I do favor freedom over tyranny and, if ppl are attacked first, they have the right to defend themselves. I'm sure you are aware of Horseshoe theory and if you have even a passing familiarity of history you are also aware "the left" does not have any sort of monopoly when it comes to violence. You won't find bigger Anti-Communists then Nazi Germany was. Look at the Spanish civil war, Pinochet, and any number of brutal tyrants we have propped up due to them being useful in the war against communism and "the left". Osama Bin Laden and co were very conservative hence why we propped him up with money and training. As much as America claims it loves freedom look at what happened with McCarthyism. Guilt by association and witch hunts in the "Land of the free". People being blacklisted and committing suicide. Also terms like "Communist" are less useful then what they do in practice. Plenty of American's are willingly moving to a Communist country and taking a vow to support their government. Including soliders who fought to put Communism down: www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2019-12-25/americans-are-retiring-to-vietnam-for-cheap-health-care-and-a-decent-living-standardI mean "freedom" is a great thing and all but if you can't afford to have the basics does it matter if you are "free" or not?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 21:23:28 GMT -5
I mean "freedom" is a great thing and all but if you can't afford to have the basics does it matter if you are "free" or not? Such an ironic thing to say. In every example of Communism, far fewer people have the basics.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 21:40:27 GMT -5
As far as I can tell, we live in a world with scarce resources. With Capitalism, a far greater % of the people get their basic needs met. Therefore, as an economic system, Capitalism has proven to be more efficient than Communism. Nobody ever said there's any one system that's perfect. But clearly, some are better than others.
Even China caught on to the advantages of Capitalism and allowed the people some degree of economic freedom. The problem with China is that they still believe in Communist tyranny, don't want to give other forms of freedom and instead trample human rights.
Perhaps some day when tech advances enough, humans might attain near infinite energy & resources, and then we might see some sort of Communist utopia like in Star Trek.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 22:55:01 GMT -5
You won't find bigger Anti-Communists then Nazi Germany was. My grandfather fought in WWII and killed Nazis. He wasn't a Communist either. This idea that if you're not on one side then you're on the other is myopic and flawed. Kinda reminds me of GW's rhetoric, "if you're not with us, you're against us."
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2020 17:37:16 GMT -5
If you don't want to take my word for it, why not go straight to source and speak & listen to people who've lived directly under Communism? I've done that myself already. My last gf was born and raised in Vietnam. Her and her brother liked to discuss politics and they had no love for Communism. They're smart people too, successful in school & work. They recognized that our media lies and our govt has flaws, but they much prefer it over Vietnam. There's the YT channel "serpentza". This dude lived in China for many years and knows what life is really like there. Check out some of his videos. www.youtube.com/user/serpentza/videosAyn Rand was raised in Communist Russia and she had keen insight on life under Communism. Her book "Anthem," dissects Communism and its flaws thoroughly. For ppl too busy or too lazy to read a whole book, here are the cliff notes. www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/a/anthem/book-summary
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2020 21:34:12 GMT -5
I don't agree with Tucker on a lot of things, but this one is pretty entertaining. He questions the ruling class on how they're destroying America and their ongoing, phony propaganda that Trump & Sanders are Russian puppets.
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Post by ForRealTho on Feb 25, 2020 22:30:21 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2020 22:44:10 GMT -5
He's technically not ruling class, since he's not a politician. But he's an elitist, having admitted to his huge inheritance. The way he lies and diverts attention is not different from the politicians though. Democrat elites included. They rail against climate change while polluting at 100,000x the rate of average citizen through the corporations they've inherited and flying around the world in their private jets.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2020 13:08:56 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2020 20:06:02 GMT -5
Where I'm coming from is that while I supported the Clintons in the past, even with money, what Hillary did to Libya amounts to being a war crime. Some of the groups she backed looted Qadaffi's armories and went on to further push Syria into a horrible Civil War. The proven war monger lost to the unproven war monger, one who had neither the experience nor the inclination for it, so I did not mourn her loss. On a happier note, one of the least war mongerier of the 2016 candidates seems to be running again. Sanders: 2020 Hindsight In the news today, a judge orders Hillary to answer questions about the leaked classified emails and the Benghazi scandal. Wow. I thought she was already given a pass for her corruption shit. I know the other guys here don't want to hear about it, but you can web search it if you're interested.
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Post by Babel-17 on Mar 3, 2020 21:32:55 GMT -5
Where I'm coming from is that while I supported the Clintons in the past, even with money, what Hillary did to Libya amounts to being a war crime. Some of the groups she backed looted Qadaffi's armories and went on to further push Syria into a horrible Civil War. The proven war monger lost to the unproven war monger, one who had neither the experience nor the inclination for it, so I did not mourn her loss. On a happier note, one of the least war mongerier of the 2016 candidates seems to be running again. Sanders: 2020 Hindsight In the news today, a judge orders Hillary to answer questions about the leaked classified emails and the Benghazi scandal. Wow. I thought she was already given a pass for her corruption shit. I know the other guys here don't want to hear about it, but you can web search it if you're interested. My donations helped pay for that.
My money has been going to Tulsi Gabbard for a while. She's an extremely important voice in keeping us from destroying more towns, cities, and homes, in the Middle East. Clinton's backers are super pissed that they aren't getting their gas pipeline through Syria, and have their fingers crossed that they can get Biden elected and then distract him with cat toys while they finish the job that Clinton set into motion. Or just appoint Hunter to the board of a company that will profit from it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2020 21:55:58 GMT -5
Babel-17, thank you for the contribution towards setting our country in the right direction. More people should take off the partisan blinders and condemn all corrupt politicians, regardless of party affiliation.
Why do we need a f'in gas pipeline through Syria? You know it's just to line the pockets of the corrupt politicians and the captains of industry (chief campaign contributors, no doubt). The U.S. is a net fossil fuel exporter, so this is BS. We don't need to be so involved in the middle-east, especially not militarily.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2020 22:07:18 GMT -5
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Post by ForRealTho on Mar 3, 2020 22:45:48 GMT -5
Where I'm coming from is that while I supported the Clintons in the past, even with money, what Hillary did to Libya amounts to being a war crime. Some of the groups she backed looted Qadaffi's armories and went on to further push Syria into a horrible Civil War. The proven war monger lost to the unproven war monger, one who had neither the experience nor the inclination for it, so I did not mourn her loss. On a happier note, one of the least war mongerier of the 2016 candidates seems to be running again. Sanders: 2020 Hindsight In the news today, a judge orders Hillary to answer questions about the leaked classified emails and the Benghazi scandal. Wow. I thought she was already given a pass for her corruption shit. I know the other guys here don't want to hear about it, but you can web search it if you're interested. Hilary is boring af. Boring lesser of two evils candidate and the Republican party has been after her and Bill for decades. Like she didn't win the election and isn't in office at all. Snore.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 0:31:09 GMT -5
It's boring enough for you to comment on. Funny. Well, if you're not worried about the DNC conspiring with their preferred candidate again, then it's all good.. voters (like Babel) don't need to be so proactive.
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Post by ForRealTho on Mar 4, 2020 9:10:24 GMT -5
It's boring enough for you to comment on. Funny. Well, if you're not worried about the DNC conspiring with their preferred candidate again, then it's all good.. voters (like Babel) don't need to be so proactive. Sanders was my preferred candidate in 2016 and ofc now in 2020. Never cared for Clinton. I first remember hearing about how they were going to "take her down" back in the early 90s when I was in elementary school(side note I was assigned to debate why Ross Perot should be President while 2 of my other classmates had to support Clinton or Bush lol). I am nearly 40 years old and they are still talking about "taking her down". Hence the boredom. About a year ago I was playing a game and someone started yelling about locking up Hilary over voice comms. You go bro, fight the power. Even tho she has never been and will never be president. There is a conspiracy that Hilary is still running the "deep state" and hence we need to give Trump king like powers to stop her. Dunno if you subscribe to that.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 11:42:00 GMT -5
They already "took her down", in regards to politics when Trump won. Soon after Trump was elected, he openly stated that he wouldn't pursue investigations of Clinton. Seems there are opposing forces within the Democrat party, one corrupt and the others fighting corruption (which Babel donated to).
Also, people died.. not just from the Benghazi incident, but also leaked intelligence. It wasn't front page news for some odd reason, however, I did read an article on it. Dozens of U.S. undercover agents were exposed by intelligence leaks and assassinated. You seriously don't believe the families of all the dead aren't fervently pursuing justice to this day and prompting a Judge to reopen questioning? Nah, it has to Trump bribing the judge, risking a scandal that could cost him his re-election bid. lol
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 13:08:58 GMT -5
Here's one that's on Trump. Abandoning the Kurds (who sacrificed 11,000 Kurds fighting ISIS) to be slaughtered by Turks.. www.businessinsider.com/military-leaders-warn-trump-abandoning-ally-grave-mistake-2019-10Of course, it's a strategic military move letting the Turks have their way, since the U.S. relies heavily on Turkish air bases. Situations like this, having to turn our back on one ally to appease another ally, is another reason military involvement should be a last resort and defensive only.
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